Visit krishna-167929's column >>

KRISHNA-167929Home Page

I took the one less traveled by, And that has made all the difference. (Robert Frost)
Add To Watchlist
Articles Posted: 0; Links Seeded: 3537
Member Since: 7/2007

Crisis Darfur: How The Left Embraced The Genocide In Darfur

News Type: Opinion — Seeded on Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:07 AM EDT
advertisement

[A conversation with Mia Farrow and Bernard-Henri Lévy, moderated by Dinaw Mengestu].

Part I- French philosopher Bernard-Henri Lévy on how 3 great ideas of the political left have backfired on the people of Darfur:

...I would like to sum up in a few remarks what I saw and what I concluded during this journey which I made in this very ill-informed area. We have very little information from this area where I was, with a photographer of the French agency Gamma. I would like to sum up the conclusion I did draw from this journey. My first conclusion was and still is that we should stop speaking of the crisis of Darfur or even the war in Darfur. It is not a crisis. It is not a war. A war presupposes of course a frontline, presupposes organized battles, and presupposes, even more, two real armies. It is not a war between two armies. It is a war by an army against civilian populations. It is not a civil war, it is a war against civilians...

Published to:

What's this?
Who's leading the conversation?
This visualization below allows you to see the impact that each user has on the current conversation. The top row contains the group of users who have had the most impact, the 2nd row the group of users who have had the 2nd most impact (et cetera). Users with similar impact are grouped together, and the average score of the group is shown to the left of the group. The author of the article is also shown on the left, in their corresponding group. Each user's score is based on the number of comments the user has made plus the number of votes their comments have received. The scores are calculated relative one another, so while their absolute value is not particularly important, their relative difference does indicate a larger difference in impact on the conversation.
17
9.0
{"commentId":2052197,"authorDomain":"krishna109"}
krishna-167929

"...This huge mass murder [that's] impossible to calculate, these hundreds of miniscule lives, tiny lives not even worthy of remembrance, or who their murderers rendered not even worthy of remembrance. There is a very famous American book of James Agee, Let Us Now Praise Famous Men. I would like tonight, and I have tried without stopping for one year, to praise, to try to praise, if I can, unfamous men, men without fame, men without names, murdered people without any trace in the memory of mankind. This is Darfur today. I don't know if it is genocide or not, but it is a situation which is uncomparable to most of the killings which take place, and which are also horrible of course, in other places of the world. You have some places where you have some killings, you have some funerals, you have the possibility to cry, you have the possibility to [count] the number. Here, it is the reverse.

The question now is to know why. My last, or nearly last remark: why? And why is the international community so passive?... Why this inability to [make] decisions or, when they are made, to make them respected?"

(The author then goes on to give 3 reasons for the massive lack of concern...)

{"commentId":2052197,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"krishna109"}
  • 3 votes
Reply#1 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:08 AM EDT
{"commentId":2060490,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Anti-colonialism: we have been bred in the idea, in the conviction that colonialismand it is trueis a crime, is something we have to get rid of; intervention in the affairs of a country of the third world is something we have to avoid absolutely because it produced such ill effects in the past, colonialism. This is true. And it produces the idea that when a country of the third world which was colonized (as was Sudan), commits such bloodbaths, commits such crimes, to stop this, to try to prevent this, to intervene in order to make it stop, could be an act of colonialism.

And in America and in France, you have a lot of people [of] the Left, to which I belong, [who believe that] we cannot interfere in the internal affairs of Sudan. Lets be careful not to impose under the flag of human rights the old rule of Western superiority. The result of which is that we are abandoning to that [idea] the worst death, these unnumbered lots of people. And in the end: anti-racism, anti-colonialism, and anti-imperialism. We are prisoners of a scheme of thought in which, if you are a victim and if you dont play a role, if you dont have a part on the big stage, in the big history, in the big tale of the opposition of the evil empire and the good anti-imperialist forces, you dont really deserve attention.

{"commentId":2060490,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 2 votes
Reply#2 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:38 PM EDT
{"commentId":2060560,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Fascinating article. Interesting notions...I've thought of this before, that this anti-colonialism, bred out of a very real concern for the crimes committed by colonial powers, the residual effects of which we can still see today--that this surge of anti-colonialism has had the unfortunate effect not of doing anything actually good to help these people in the Third World, but rather just to do nothing at all, as though it were better to have our hands clean than to risk any bloodstains.

This is absurd to me. We have no intention of Empire or Colonization. To intervene in Darfur and other troubled areas would be an act of humanitarian intervention. It cannot be defined in the same way as our intentions are utterly different. This is not to say we should be responsible for nation building per say, but there is no moral justification for not intervening against Khartoum. Sanctions, boycotts, publicity in the media, and yes, invasion if necessary. The people dying have no way of defending themselves. They are outgunned, out funded, impoverished and starving, dying in the hundreds of thousands....

{"commentId":2060560,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 3 votes
Reply#3 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:44 PM EDT
{"commentId":2060828,"authorDomain":"kpr37"}
kpr37

In the story I wrote last week I tried to show how Paul Salopek removed the horror from the tail of a two year old child.-----In Gaga Refugee Camp Chad he speaks of how this child tyrannized his family's life not the Janjaweed who are committing a Genocide on the Masalit people

{"commentId":2060828,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"kpr37"}
  • 1 vote
#3.1 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:11 PM EDT
{"commentId":2060965,"authorDomain":"krishna109"}
krishna-167929
To intervene in Darfur and other troubled areas would be an act of humanitarian intervention. It cannot be defined in the same way as our intentions are utterly different. This is not to say we should be responsible for nation building per say, but there is no moral justification for not intervening against Khartoum. Sanctions, boycotts, publicity in the media, and yes, invasion if necessary. The people dying have no way of defending themselves. They are outgunned, out funded, impoverished and starving, dying in the hundreds of thousands....

A while back, there was an article on NV where the brutal horros of the regime in Myanmar were discussed-- and the opinion was expressed that somethign should be done. Many agreed about the horrs the people are facing, and suggested everything from signing online petitions-- to having people wear T shirts of a certain colour the next Friday to portest! (I kid you not-- these were amongst the dominant theories of what the best course of action would be.)

It was suggested that military intervention would probably be the only thing that would stop the regime from committing its atrocities. Well-- people were shocked! The idea of taking (efdffective) action was considered to be totally unacceptable.

And, of course, no one has taken military action-- and the perople of Myanmar continue to suffer--- because of this absurd "politicla correctness".

{"commentId":2060965,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"krishna109"}
  • 1 vote
#3.2 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:26 PM EDT
{"commentId":2062895,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain
And, of course, no one has taken military action-- and the perople of Myanmar continue to suffer--- because of this absurd "politicla correctness".

And this article really does a fantastic job at explaining the cultural-psychological dynamics that cause this political correctness. Excellent find. Truly.

{"commentId":2062895,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 2 votes
#3.3 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:47 AM EDT
Reply
{"commentId":2061019,"authorDomain":"krishna109"}
krishna-167929

I just searched for, and found, that article: A good reason for the US to invade another foreign country. An excellent article (but perhaps even more interesting are some of the comments :-)

{"commentId":2061019,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"krishna109"}
  • 2 votes
Reply#4 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:31 PM EDT
{"commentId":2061170,"authorDomain":"kpr37"}
kpr37

Can you make the two story's appear together sum how some place to show the hypocrisy of the article it is on there web site under-- Gaga refugee camp, chad.- my story is in the group two hands-The true story of Ahmed Juma Abakar-- I am stupid and can not do this?

{"commentId":2061170,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"kpr37"}
    Reply#5 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:47 PM EDT
    {"commentId":2061593,"authorDomain":"krishna109"}
    krishna-167929
    Can you make the two story's appear together sum how some place to show the hypocrisy of the article it is on there web site under-- Gaga refugee camp, chad.- my story is in the group two hands-The true story of Ahmed Juma Abakar-- I am stupid and can not do this?

    I just read your comment and cannot understand what you said. Can you re-phrase the questioN? What exactly do you mean by "making two stories appear together"??? What do you mean by "sum"? Addition-- the sum of two numbers? And .."there web site"...do you mean "there"..or "their"?

    {"commentId":2061593,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"krishna109"}
    • 1 vote
    #5.1 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 9:35 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":2061743,"authorDomain":"kpr37"}
    kpr37

    how you embed one story within another-- please read The true story of Ahmed Juma Abakar it is about dar- fur and this genocide.I think it is a story that should be told--on my site under articles on rss I would like your opinion thank you for your time-- like you did with a good reason for the US to invade

    {"commentId":2061743,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      Reply#6 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 9:52 PM EDT
      {"commentId":2061896,"authorDomain":"krishna109"}
      krishna-167929
      how you embed one story within another-- please read The true story of Ahmed Juma Abakar it is about dar- fur and this genocide.I think it is a story that should be told--on my site under articles on rss I would like your opinion thank you for your time-- like you did with a good reason for the US to invade

      OK-- I think I understand what you mean now.

      What I did there was put a link to another article in a comment. As you mentioned, this can be useful in that it lets people know about another article that may be of interest-- another article that is related to the strory.

      In order to place a link in a comment, here's what you must do:

      1. Click the small grey box, directly above the comment box-- the one that says Link. A window will open. It says "Enter the URL". (the URL is the address of the article-- it always starts with http://

      Type in the URL of the story you want to link to.

      2. After you click "OK", the link's URL will appear in the comment box. At the end of the URL there is a > symbol. Directly after this symbol, type in the words you want people to see-- the words they will click to go to the article. (For example, in comment #4 here, I typed in the words : "A good reason for the US to invade another foreign country". If people click that, they will go to that article.

      You can type in the bname of the article-- or somestimes people just type in the word LINK...or Here's the Link.. or even (Read the article).

      3. After you finish typing that, you must indicate that that is the end of the link. To do this go to the same button on top of the comment box-- it now says /Link-- click this and hit "Enter".

      You may have to try it a few times before you can figure it out-- but its really pretty simple.

      This is called putting a link into a comment box.

      {"commentId":2061896,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"krishna109"}
      • 2 votes
      #6.1 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:13 PM EDT
      Reply
      {"commentId":2062032,"authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      kpr37

      thank you I will try it, wish me luck I am a 44 year old construction worker who just bought a computer 2 months ago. it keeps me out of the bars. lets see what happens

      {"commentId":2062032,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      • 3 votes
      Reply#7 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:31 PM EDT
      {"commentId":2062288,"authorDomain":"krishna109"}
      krishna-167929
      thank you I will try it, wish me luck I am a 44 year old construction worker who just bought a computer 2 months ago. it keeps me out of the bars. lets see what happens

      You may have ot experiment with it a bit, but eventually you will be able to figure it out.

      Good for you-- most people who aren't familiar with computers don't have the courage to try to figure out how to use these infernal contraptions!

      {"commentId":2062288,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"krishna109"}
      • 3 votes
      #7.1 - Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:05 PM EDT
      {"commentId":2062914,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
      E.D.Kain

      Yes, good for you. It's easy to lose perspective in a bar (I know from first hand experience). Then again, it's easy to lose perspective on a computer, but it's a start. ;-)

      {"commentId":2062914,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
      • 1 vote
      #7.2 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:50 AM EDT
      {"commentId":2063022,"authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      kpr37

      I know I want to hit it with a hammer, I am trying To put the two story's together on your site Two Hands. to show that what the real story can be if you look for the truth.you may find it. and some one should speak for the Innocent child who was unlucky to be named George Bush in the middle of a genocide "I wonder if he is still alive"

      {"commentId":2063022,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      • 2 votes
      #7.3 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:14 AM EDT
      Reply
      {"commentId":2063168,"authorDomain":"backroadsbubba"}
      backroads

      I remember a columnist for "The Guardian" downplaying Darfur, smugly insisting far fewer had perished than what most groups claimed.

      {"commentId":2063168,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"backroadsbubba"}
      • 4 votes
      Reply#8 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:58 AM EDT
      {"commentId":2063379,"authorDomain":"amber-valenzuela"}
      Amber-297400

      I love how people take the stance of "well ONLY xxxx amount of people have died" Uh wtf ANYONE dying in that way and for those kinds of reasons is NOT acceptable... or am I incorrect?

      {"commentId":2063379,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"amber-valenzuela"}
      • 3 votes
      #8.1 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 3:14 AM EDT
      {"commentId":2064434,"authorDomain":"backroadsbubba"}
      backroads

      I fired off an angry letter to the character . . . and I was informed he was on leave. Not surprising.

      {"commentId":2064434,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"backroadsbubba"}
      • 4 votes
      #8.2 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:39 AM EDT
      {"commentId":2065115,"authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      kpr37

      most people just do not care about Dar-fur I have often wondered why

      {"commentId":2065115,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"kpr37"}
      • 4 votes
      #8.3 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:13 AM EDT
      {"commentId":2065377,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
      E.D.Kain
      I love how people take the stance of "well ONLY xxxx amount of people have died" Uh wtf ANYONE dying in that way and for those kinds of reasons is NOT acceptable... or am I incorrect?

      Exactly. It's very easy to speak in abstract terms over things like genocide, throw around numbers, etc. The fact is, the militias carrying this out would stand no chance against our military or against NATO. We would likely suffer very few casualties at all and save tens of thousands of people's lives. The only factor that would really be a problem is, of course, as usual, CHINA.

      {"commentId":2065377,"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
      • 4 votes
      #8.4 - Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:42 AM EDT
      Reply
      {"canLink":false,"threadId":"299348","isPrivate":false}
      Leave a Comment:
      You're in Easy Mode. If you prefer, you can use XHTML Mode instead.
      Newsvine Privacy Statement
      As a new user, you may notice a few temporary content restrictions. Click here for more info.
      {"threadId":"299348","contentId":"1612180"}
      Start TrackingStart Tracking
      Stop TrackingStop Tracking
      Back To Top | Front Page